How can we suck less?

[ChristopherS]

On 11/3/2024 at 2:06 AM, Bubbafett said:

Honestly, I think that a lot of my issues with the review system could be completely ignored if ALL support request were public. I again, have no way of knowing if there is 1 or 100 unanswered support request on a plugin that hasn't had a request in a while. Making reviews more transparent would be the way I would expect something like to be handled, however if I could see all support request that would also increase platform trust.

I have spent no small amount of money on this site, and will continue to do so. I would just like to have to a better picture of what I am getting BEFORE i buy it. Some plugins can be $40 or more and this is no small amount to spend basing it off the description, potentially HUNDREDS post in the discussions tab (Many of which will just be rambling of confused users who can't edit a config), a potentially incomplete picture of a support page, and filtered reviews. I understand that no matter what it will be an educated guess on my part on if a plugin will be good or not, however making this guess easier be pretty great.

I sometimes hide my support requests because I upload videos to YouTube for the developer to see the issue through sight, rather than than from my crappy descriptive skills.

My YouTube channel is personal and I don't want others seeing this.

I get your point though.

[ChristopherS]

On 11/3/2024 at 2:52 AM, dustyhansen said:

I literally mean negative or critical. Such as the zombies not looking like zombies or being overpowered. These are not "support issues" as they are not bugs or broken issues with the plugin. 

You say here that we cannot complain about the plugin in a review or make a suggestion in a review unless we have reported it to the developer first? That is ridiculous. You are literally saying you only approve positive reviews about a plugin. 

 

I am in the right. I am the customer and nobody else is coming to your defense here saying that your review process is fair and unbiased. You are providing me with information on how YOU have decided reviews should be moderated on this site and I am telling you it is wrong and am doing so in a forum where you asked for feedback to improve your site.

I'm a customer, and I've defended the review process MULTIPLE times throughout this entire discussion. 

[dustyhansen]

On 10/6/2024 at 11:36 AM, ChristopherS said:

I've wrote several negative reviews. None were hidden at all.

The only reason a review is hidden is if it contains information not relevant, or you haven't taken the steps needed to fix the problem.

You have written 22 5-star reviews and 1 4-star review. Only one of your reviews was edited from negative to positive, so you are lying.

That is not true, but we have since proven that with the conversation in this thread. But even if that were true, it is still wrong. A review that mentions something broken is still a valid review. Whether you have spent 7 weeks (as you did) trying to get the plugin fixed is irrelevant.

BTW, this is your only comment "supporting" the review process on this site, so your MULTIPLE defenses of the review process is also a lie.

[Death]

21 minutes ago, dustyhansen said:

You have written 22 5-star reviews and 1 4-star review. Only one of your reviews was edited from negative to positive, so you are lying.

That is not true, but we have since proven that with the conversation in this thread. But even if that were true, it is still wrong. A review that mentions something broken is still a valid review. Whether you have spent 7 weeks (as you did) trying to get the plugin fixed is irrelevant.

BTW, this is your only comment "supporting" the review process on this site, so your MULTIPLE defenses of the review process is also a lie.

Someone with 22 reviews will have much more insight into the process than most people. I don't get your fixation on negative reviews. You're assuming everyone is going to have a bad experience, but that's just not the case.

You can argue about how you think reviews should be all you want, but it's not going to change anything. Our system works and is favored by both customers and creators. We even did a poll where the entire community voted in favor of our current system. As I said before, you're going to find yourself in the minority here.

[ChristopherS]

48 minutes ago, dustyhansen said:

You have written 22 5-star reviews and 1 4-star review. Only one of your reviews was edited from negative to positive, so you are lying.

That is not true, but we have since proven that with the conversation in this thread. But even if that were true, it is still wrong. A review that mentions something broken is still a valid review. Whether you have spent 7 weeks (as you did) trying to get the plugin fixed is irrelevant.

BTW, this is your only comment "supporting" the review process on this site, so your MULTIPLE defenses of the review process is also a lie.

No, I've written 1* reviews in the past because developers didn't respond to my support requests for 7 weeks for example, but in the end explained to me that they had family issues. After the problem was resolved, I edited the review to reflect that.

If I write a 1* review and every point is resolved, of course I'm going to go back and update the review. 

Here's some direct links to me backing the current review process in only this thread. I get that you're angry, but calling me a liar doesn't make sense when I clearly have supported this. You must have missed these comments when reading this entire thread:

https://codefling.com/forums/topic/1552-how-can-we-suck-less/?do=findComment&comment=4905
https://codefling.com/forums/topic/1552-how-can-we-suck-less/?do=findComment&comment=4997

Edited November 6 by ChristopherS

[dustyhansen]

19 minutes ago, Death said:

Someone with 22 reviews will have much more insight into the process than most people. I don't get your fixation on negative reviews. You're assuming everyone is going to have a bad experience, but that's just not the case.

You can argue about how you think reviews should be all you want, but it's not going to change anything. Our system works and is favored by both customers and creators. We even did a poll where the entire community voted in favor of our current system. As I said before, you're going to find yourself in the minority here.

Someone with 22 5 star reviews is not going to be affected by your deceptive process as you approve those without issue. My fixation is on negative reviews because those are the ones you are censoring and refusing to publish.

Again, you posted a thread asking for feedback and are shitting all over the feedback you get, so not sure why that is. I don't care if it doesn't change anything and of course it is favored by creators, they don't get negative reviews without first getting to adjust their product to prevent the review from getting posted.

The "entire community" voted? Sure. Where is this poll that is strictly asking if your current practice of moderating reviews is favored by customers? Any poll that includes creators is automatically worthless since the policy favors them heavily.

I don't care if I am in the minority either. Again, you asked for the feedback and I (and others) are giving it. Grow up, listen to the feedback, and decide what to do with it (which is obviously nothing). For you to publicly argue and shame your customers is atrocious.

[dustyhansen]

10 minutes ago, ChristopherS said:

No, I've written 1* reviews because developers didn't respond to my support requests and in the end explained to me that they had family issues. After the problem was resolved, I edited the review to reflect that.

If I write a 1* review and every point is resolved, of course I'm going to go back and update the review. 

Again, you wrote 1 negative review. I have 1 negative review that was published as well. I didn't say it was a problem that you updated it. I am saying that you are not in a position to speak on this topic.

[ChristopherS]

4 minutes ago, dustyhansen said:

Again, you wrote 1 negative review. I have 1 negative review that was published as well. I didn't say it was a problem that you updated it. I am saying that you are not in a position to speak on this topic.

You're referring to the 4* review I've wrote as negative? That's a positive review. You called me a liar, then when I provided you the links to the proof, you ignore it. I don't understand why you're being so aggressive towards me when I'm literally just giving you my experiences here.

I have written 1* reviews that were published. They were not hidden or kept away at all. Yes, the problem was rectified from the developer, so I went in and changed the rating. It's unfair for me not to. That's why you only see positive reviews from me currently.
 

[Death]

9 minutes ago, dustyhansen said:

Again, you posted a thread asking for feedback and are shitting all over the feedback you get, so not sure why that is. I don't care if it doesn't change anything and of course it is favored by creators, they don't get negative reviews without first getting to adjust their product to prevent the review from getting posted.

No, I'm shitting all over your evident personal affliction with our review process. I appreciate the feedback, but that's not what you're doing here. You're trying to contradict anyone who speaks positively about something you dislike. You're now having a spitting match with someone who is likely in the top 10% of users with the most reviews and telling them they're least qualified to have an opinion on them lol

[dustyhansen]

1 hour ago, ChristopherS said:

You're referring to the 4* review I've wrote as negative? That's a positive review. You called me a liar, then when I provided you the links to the proof, you ignore it. I don't understand why you're being so aggressive towards me when I'm literally just giving you my experiences here.

I have written 1* reviews that were published. They were not hidden or kept away at all. Yes, the problem was rectified from the developer, so I went in and changed the rating. It's unfair for me not to. That's why you only see positive reviews from me currently.
 

What links did you provide? You only have one review that was edited! I go by what I see on the site and I don't see all these reviews that were edited from 1 star to positive that you are talking about.

I am aggressive because you are defending their process and you haven't been subject to it. And because you claim to have written tons of negative reviews, which you haven't and because you claimed to have defended the process multiple times, which you didn't. So I am just calling it like I see it.

[ChristopherS]

2 minutes ago, dustyhansen said:

What links did you provide? You only have one review that was edited! I go by what I see on the site and I don't see all these reviews that were edited from 1 star to positive that you are talking about.

I am aggressive because you are defending their process and you haven't been subject to it. And because you claim to have written tons of negative reviews, which you haven't and because you claimed to have defended the process multiple times, which you didn't. So I am just calling it like I see it.

5 comments above: 

 

[dustyhansen]

1 hour ago, Death said:

No, I'm shitting all over your evident personal affliction with our review process. I appreciate the feedback, but that's not what you're doing here. You're trying to contradict anyone who speaks positively about something you dislike. You're now having a spitting match with someone who is likely in the top 10% of users with the most reviews and telling them they're least qualified to have an opinion on them lol

It is feedback, or at least it started that way, until you decided to publicly argue with me for about it. I have only contradicted 2 people that are defending your process that haven't written more than 1 negative review and haven't been subject to your censorship. And yes, again, he has written 23 reviews and only one was edited, so how is he qualified to talk about your censoring of negative reviews when he hasn't been censored? 

You want me to stop? Then I want an apology for the way I have been treated for providing feedback in a thread asking for feedback. Allow me to remind you of your first response to me: 

Remember where you replied to my feedback by telling me I was wrong, even though I accurately explained exactly what happens. You have to open support requests and then you get put in a 3-way DM with the creator and a moderator where you have to defend your review. And then later you go on to accuse me of abusing creators using reviews, calling me insane, and a number of other things.

How about acknowledging the 150 support tickets I have opened or the 130 discussion posts I have made? Trying to help the community and contributing to the enhancement and bug resolution of the plugins on this site. Where do I rank on your customer list with all my contributions and spend? Or does none of that matter because I wrote four 3-star reviews on plugins that I had feedback on so I must be an abusive customer, even though I did open tickets in all of the reviews I wrote.

[dustyhansen]

26 minutes ago, ChristopherS said:

5 comments above: 

 

LOL, sorry I didn't see that you edited the post to include links after I had already read it. And I did see one of your TWO comments as I replied to it. So, yes, you are correct, I missed the one comment you made agreeing with someone else's feedback that you are counting as your own.

But, whatever, you have written many comments supporting the process that you have submitted many negative reviews through and had them all approved without issue. I'll just agree to that since it is easier than continuing this conversation. 

[IIIaKa]

10 hours ago, Death said:

This doesn't make any sense. If, for example, we capped the fee to 30 cents for something that costs $1, we'd lose money? PayPal transaction fee alone is 0.49 cents

I just noticed that there's no option to simply top up the balance. Could this option be added? And after that, restrict direct purchases if a plugin costs less than ~$5?

Edited November 6 by IIIaKa

[Gay Sparkly T-Rex]

Maybe add a suggestions tab (similar to support tab) for addons that lets buyers post suggestions and lets the seller add tags like no thanks, planned, or even already in. I think this would help buyers looking at add-ons see if something they would want in an addon has already been suggested... I mean sure they could post in discussions but honestly who wants to ready thru several pages of discussion to see if something has maybe been suggested.

Also to touch bases on the review process I kinda like the way it is... I mean it stops spam reviews (both good and bad), it makes reviewers put more then "I really like this addon" or "F this dev there a pos scammer", The current process also gets in touch with devs if your "negitive" review is more a suggestion that wasnt implamented and maybe that dev can work with your personally... Ive had this exact thing happen with me. I wrote a "bad" review because an dev wouldnt add variances to there addon (so a min/max quantity of items) that was public... kinda made me salty (and act like a 2yo) The staff here was great and had myself, the dev and a staff member in PMs and in the end the dev of said addon offered to make a version for myself to have the variaces I was looking for!

[Death]

2 hours ago, Gay Sparkly T-Rex said:

Maybe add a suggestions tab (similar to support tab) for addons that lets buyers post suggestions and lets the seller add tags like no thanks, planned, or even already in. I think this would help buyers looking at add-ons see if something they would want in an addon has already been suggested... I mean sure they could post in discussions but honestly who wants to ready thru several pages of discussion to see if something has maybe been suggested.

Also to touch bases on the review process I kinda like the way it is... I mean it stops spam reviews (both good and bad), it makes reviewers put more then "I really like this addon" or "F this dev there a pos scammer", The current process also gets in touch with devs if your "negitive" review is more a suggestion that wasnt implamented and maybe that dev can work with your personally... Ive had this exact thing happen with me. I wrote a "bad" review because an dev wouldnt add variances to there addon (so a min/max quantity of items) that was public... kinda made me salty (and act like a 2yo) The staff here was great and had myself, the dev and a staff member in PMs and in the end the dev of said addon offered to make a version for myself to have the variaces I was looking for!

We had this before, but it was primarily used for support. We've opted just to use discussion because even there, people try to use it for support, and it's much easier for authors to have a single tab for a catch-all than having 2 tabs that users use at random.

[dustyhansen]

It would be nice if our Purchases tab showed free files we downloaded. Currently I can't see the free plugins I have downloaded anywhere, or at least that I can tell.

[dustyhansen]

It would be nice if plugins didn't completely vanish from the site as if they never existed. 

I had a plugin that I downloaded, not sure if I paid for it (I don't see it in Orders) or if it was free, but it appears to no longer exist at all on here.

https://codefling.com/plugins/remote-team-invite

So all of the discussions, support tickets, etc. are just lost? There is no way to re-download the file? No information on why it was pulled or anything? 

[Death]

10 hours ago, dustyhansen said:

It would be nice if plugins didn't completely vanish from the site as if they never existed. 

I had a plugin that I downloaded, not sure if I paid for it (I don't see it in Orders) or if it was free, but it appears to no longer exist at all on here.

https://codefling.com/plugins/remote-team-invite

So all of the discussions, support tickets, etc. are just lost? There is no way to re-download the file? No information on why it was pulled or anything? 

If it was a paid file, you'd still see it in purchases and be able to download it. For free content, the author can take it down as they please. That being said, the content within the file's page naturally becomes obsolete if you can't download the file anymore. It would be pointless to archive it.

[dustyhansen]

8 hours ago, Death said:

If it was a paid file, you'd still see it in purchases and be able to download it.

Good to know, thanks.

8 hours ago, Death said:

the content within the file's page naturally becomes obsolete if you can't download the file anymore. It would be pointless to archive it.

I guess we have a difference in opinion here, surprise! 

How is it obsolete and pointless to archive if the plugin still works and is being used today by many customers?

Usually the description of the plugin contains important information, such as what the commands and permissions are, how the plugin functions, what the dependencies are, info about config and settings, etc. This information is not readily available anywhere else.

I think there is valuable content in discussions and support tickets that shouldn't just get deleted and that could still be useful to those of us running the plugin today, even if it is no longer supported or available to download.

Plus, I think it would be good to know that the plugin is no longer supported/available as opposed to searching multiple sites trying to figure out where I got it from only to come up empty. 

Again, this seems like another decision that is not at all customer-friendly and is entirely in the creator's best interest and based on how you replied, that you are not actually open to getting feedback on. 

[Death]

On 11/17/2024 at 8:46 AM, dustyhansen said:

Good to know, thanks.

I guess we have a difference in opinion here, surprise! 

How is it obsolete and pointless to archive if the plugin still works and is being used today by many customers?

Usually the description of the plugin contains important information, such as what the commands and permissions are, how the plugin functions, what the dependencies are, info about config and settings, etc. This information is not readily available anywhere else.

I think there is valuable content in discussions and support tickets that shouldn't just get deleted and that could still be useful to those of us running the plugin today, even if it is no longer supported or available to download.

Plus, I think it would be good to know that the plugin is no longer supported/available as opposed to searching multiple sites trying to figure out where I got it from only to come up empty. 

Again, this seems like another decision that is not at all customer-friendly and is entirely in the creator's best interest and based on how you replied, that you are not actually open to getting feedback on. 

We can't really do anything if an author wants to pull their content. It is theirs after all, and we do offer to keep it public as an archive, but ultimately, it's up to them. We do require paid content to be archived, though, so customers can still access the latest version long after it's discontinued.